s sort of the primary question the primary question isn't how could i possibly know like humor descartes the question is let's let's let's presuppose that intelligibility exists because that's presupposed by everything else what must the world be like such that it's intelligible and i think there are propositions that are then derivable about what must the world be like in order to have the kind of intelligibility that is disclosed in mystical experiences and also what must cognition be like in order to be able to pick up on and pursue that kind of intelligibility so i do think there are theoretical claims that come out that way yeah i i think i think that's i think that's a that's a fine point and i think that we're going to see more of that in our upcoming upcoming conversations where we're looking at that convergence between between the rational and the real to phrases what i might that that that's a point which which is which is abstract uh which is which is okay but i might maybe maybe just to try yeah please something a bit simpler which is i think that just like there's a convergence um in the ways that you're lining it up i think there's also a a converge a metaphysical or propositional convergence um amongst the mystics um both ancient and contemporary and both in cultures that were co-influenced and as far as we understand not influenced by each other and i think that i think that that metaphysical convergence which also has plausibility because it also engages um in in affordances in in the real world um even as far as as a proposition goes is something worth paying attention to and i think that by focusing um i'm not sure who it was that you quoted by focusing on on the divergence of the proposition that that oh um i i now know that there is a god i now know that there is no god i now know that santa claus is real i now know that um and that's that's simply i think i think it's a facile um um dismissal of proposition of metaphysical claims and i think that what is better what would be important to be