epest wisdom that each one of these traditions possessed that have been painstakingly cultivated over millennia of silent introspection reflection and dialogue internally and and now and although an at scant moments in history there were moments of contact and and passing of ideas which which i'm also studying quite avidly but more or less these things were done internally and now really on a grand scale for the first time historically there's an open marketplace of ideas facilitated by things like the internet by the technologies that we have and the question is are we going to utilize those technologies to enslave ourselves to the to the to the worst angels of our nature to use steven pinker's term or we're going to allow ourselves to use this moment to find a unified narrative that can guide us both in our personal lives in our in our interpersonal dealings and in our relationship with the world around us and perhaps with something deeper or beyond whatever you want to use your language for the for the ontological reality that in the west gets a capital g yeah um so and and i think those relationships are so crude and i think i think a lot of your work and if i'm talking too long here you can interject but i think a lot of your work okay good i think a lot of your work on the meeting crisis is is really looking at the same contemporary issue in a very related way i mean you i think i think john i'm going to give away my age here but i think i think you started teaching when i was just a newborn yes [Laughter] yeah that's about right i don't i don't mean to give away your age either see this doesn't mean the non-disclosure here on both sides because because it really wasn't but um but um the tremendous amount of of wisdom and knowledge and expertise that you bring to the field from the from the scientific realm which is really your your home which is which is the cognitive science i feel that in some way i have um i don't want to say a comparable but but an equivalent intimacy with my own tradition of jewish my